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Writing a test( take a course) to obtain a licence will not necessarily solve our problems. There are too many fisherman out there who plainly dont give a sh!t about our fish. I cant count the number of times that ive told ( nicely) people that they dont need to drag the fish out of the water and they either ask if I was a cop or they just tell me to f*ck off. Im sure this has happened to everybody and not just me. No kind of course or test will change these morons. Now if we have DFO officers at the popular holes ( scale bar, tamihi, crossing, hatchery at the chehalis ) people will have to fish ethically or risk losing his/her rod. And they should post it in the licence itself that you will lose your rod if you mistreat a fish. I still like my idea of one fish limit.
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| Sunday,
November 25, - 02:04 pm <16655&page=8/2150">
Do you want anyone of any age to have to write a test or write it once your 16. 16 is the age for an angler to get a license.
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I'd fully support a course to acquire a fishing license. I believe that education is the best method of prevention. If people have taken a course they can't plead ignorance. A course should expose people to angling ethics, fishing methods, identifying fish, their habitat, how to UNDERSTAND the REGS (there should be a course on that all by itself). Now for quite a few fishermen this stuff is need to know information, which will improve a day on the water, but other's either don't care or don't believe they are doing anything wrong. The funny thing is that a lot of people will stick their nose up in their air at this kind of thing. I've seen the "most ethical" (self-acclaimed title) handle fish terribly. I watched a "great fisherman" drag a 4lb. rainbow up on the rocks at the Adams two years ago and then kick it back into the river. The best thing to do would be to set an example and encourage this sort of thing. It'll only make fisherman as a whole a better group. Who knows you might even learn something! (Brett they do know what they buy in the market because it has a plastic tag on the side of the package. Now maybe if we could get the fish branded at the hatchery........)
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Our biggest problem puts us back to square one.I've just read the opinion from Ross, in which he is entitled to.First of all, we don't need courses, we don't need excuses, and finally we don't need a small group of fishermen ruining it for all.What we do need is a license that is possibly linked to your drivers license in which the government has all pertinent information already.All fishermen need to follow the same guide lines.We don't need fishermen dragging wild fish on the beach or taking the wrong species of fish.This is where a swipe card license comes into play.If someone is caught doing illegal fishing, then they should be fined, plain and simple.Being linked to your drivers license makes sure the fine is paid or you don't drive.I hate government involvement just as much as the next guy, but I am even more sick of so-called fishermen pulling a fish up in the sand and saying "Does anyone know what kind of fish this is."(this is only one of the many examples) That is plain ignorance.Do they not know what they buy at the supermarket either? As far as enhancement, I agree, enhance the sh-t out of every creek around to bring up returns.The U.S. does it with remarkable sucess.With regard to cost,any government program costs money, but in the long run, there should be some money returned with fines because fishermen will have to pay them before getting their license renewed.This is only my opinion, but we have to start somewhere if we want to see fishing for future generations. Brett Pott
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The general premise of the idea is good in that the objectives are too reduce crowds, increase the quality of the fishing experience for those remaining, once a new set of hoops has eliminated the riff raff. The solution that is being discussed here is...make it (the right to fish) so hard to obtain for the types of fisherman you dont like (or I don't like, or whatever) My concerns are these. Another level of government and liscencing, adds more red tape, more funds extracted from fisherman. I am not really comfortable with a swipe card, I really dont think the government needs that much information about who I am and what I do. Rights. I am a steelhead fisherman, a saltwater gear fisherman, a steelhead flyfisherman, a salmon gear and fly fisherman, I am a bobber and worm fisherman, when I feel like it. I think there is a general feeling, expecially in the Lower mainland, about trying to impose certain personal preferences on other people. I hear people on boards, boards like this one, fisherman talking down to others regarding gear, tackle, methods etc. Reality sets in--we are all fisherman, there is only one fraternity. I am personally against anything that might limit the rights of people to pursue fish, when you invite regulation, you invite loss of rights. How would a test and or short course help any. We write tests and have more strict liscencing with hunting. I hunt--like fisherman there are ethical and unethical hunters regardless of whether a test or a course was imposed. This is where I am going to address the reality. The majority of the demand in the lower mainland is for "The Vedder River" or "The Chehalis River". I know most of you have been to these places. CROWDS, and I dont really care where on these rivers you fish (IE. Secret Holes???--they dont exist). Bottom line, treat fishing rivers like facilities--there is no choice. We need more facilities more room to fish and more fish. I know that there are pseudo-biologists out there, a few used to post on this site, that say..preserve this, save that. Unfortunately, we have no choice (Have you been to the Vedder lately? Or have you been to the Chehalis Hatchery hole? (I am purposely not mentioning other less popular places that I fish--because I already share those places with a dozen other guys that also realise that 20 fish divided by 50 fisherman is a less attractive deal than 10 fish divided by 5 fisherman--simple math). What I love most about my excursions fishing in the Lower mainland is the diverse set of characters you meet. I have a good chuckle the hole way home. The river is the great social leveller (No boat required, mediocre equipment puts you in the game, works out better if you are unemployed) People from all walks of life wind up fishing on the side of the river. Lets face it, the serenity of the experience is seldom that great when you compare it to somewhere more remote--. My fear is that more added costs and more red tape will eliminate the people that I love to see on the river out there, just having a good time: (Gum boots, track pants and a spinning rod, just having a ball) Herrling Island during sockeye season....what a gong show...Yet I find myself perversely attracted to it. So what am I saying....Here is where some of you cringe.....Enhance the hell out of everything within two hours of Vancouver and spread everyone out. POINT, let those who want the Vedder river have it, let those who want the hatchery hole have it, let those who want Herrling island have it. For those of you who want that extra quality of experience---pay more to do it or work harder for it, just don't make that poor sap who cant afford it, pay for it and take another course that is probably in a language he doesn't understand. Just my opinion.
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I actually have no problem with a licensing program. I had to take a CORE program to get my hunting license and everyone that drives a vehicle must have taken training of one sort or another. It would be a difficult thing to implement, certainly would be a lot of naysayers, but it would clean up the fisheries. Kids go through a Junior Core program for hunting and I see no reason why a fishery course should stop anyone from fishing. It would certainly give everyone a better respect for the sport and the fish. It might even weed out some of the more garbage fishermen who only want MEAT, and lots of it. I know Ontario has a swipe card that encompasses both fishing and hunting, and the best way they have of ensuring compliance is not having officers out in the field, but on the roads. They set up random road blocks all during the various seasons and check the card with the catch. I understand the fines can be quite high and can even include jail time. Methinks it might be time we looked into the same out here.
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| Saturday,
November 24, - 06:13 am <16647&page=8/2150">
Mike, et al Perhaps the discussion which I started some time ago titled "NEEDED - NEW FISHING LICENSE METHOD" might give some insight to your concern Mike. It is in the General Discussion section. Just the other day I was at the river and a lady 75 yards down river was fishing with runners on. She caught a wild coho and dragged it right to the edge of the sand in almost 0" of water. For almost 3 minutes the coho kicked in this location while the poor girl bent over trying to get the hook out afraid she might get her runners wet. Everytime she bent over the fish would move and she would pull away ..... heaven forbid she can't get her runners wet or muddy. Finally seeing enough of this torture I walked down the bank and released and revived the fish. The lady said thanks .... unfortunately my response was not equal to her kindness. Frustrated, I explained to the lady that I did not want nor accept her thanks. I did not stop fishing myself to help her, but to end the torture to the fish she was killing. I told her that fishing in runners was not appropriate and that the fish she had just mistreated would probably die due to the mud it had consumed and it's duration out of the water. Did the Lady stop fishing ...... NO!! Unfortunately this is the reality of the situation today. And the Sockeye fishery is even worse. There is little or no respect by many so called "Anglers" for the fish, nature or anyone else anymore. I'm sure everyone has their own experiences and all we have to do is look around any river bank to see what our respect for nature is. Stu Kemle
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What do you think about writing a test to get your Angling licence?
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Sounds ridiculous to me...... Thats just my opinion. Tight Lines
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Fish on
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The kind of test I meen would have questions like Salmon identification. what does a hatchery fish look like? what are gear restrictions. limits. how do you release a fish. Or what about the old fish tag program,that made you tag every fish killed.
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Good idea Mike.First of all, we need more fisheries officers on the water.Secondly,a license like your drivers license should be issued.When it comes time for license renewal, the sport shop swips your card and you pay for it with any stamps you would like to purchase.If there are any tickets against you, then you must pay for them before receiving your license.When a fisheries officer approaches you, he to can swip your card with a hand held unit to check your license,that simple. Anyone caught fishing without the appropriate license will be charged(which could be linked to their drivers license).We will also have people out there playing stupid, saying they didn't understand the regulations or didn't know what type of fish they kept.They would be charged regardless.When you get a drivers license you have to know the rules before driving and this shouldn't be any different.People have to start taking responsibility for their own actions, and in my opinion this would be a good start.The initial investment would be somewhat pricey, but what government program isn't.I know alot of people will think this is a waste of time and money,but the honest fisherman should look at this as a step in the right direction to protecting a most valuable resource. Brett Pott
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Stellar Idea, you made some excellent points Brett
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Not a bad idea and personally I would take the time and pay more to take the test and get my license because like most of you avid anglers, I will do anything to fish. It would be a large operation that is time consuming and costly for the government, but it'll definitely eliminate a lot of ignorant excuses by violators. It would bring awareness of fish id to the general public and all anglers will have no problems when it comes to differentiating a steelhead and a coho. On the other hand, we would eliminate a group in the angling community, and that would be the parents who take the kids fishing once or twice per year simply because the kids wants to try it out. Do we enforce these rules on them as well? If so, do you think the parents are willing to take the time to take these tests and spend more money just for a few hours of weekend outings? Most likely not, and we would take away the pleasure and happiness that these kids can gain from fishing. Would we apply these tests to one day licenses as well? These are just some of the many complicated issues. I think such program would favour the really hardcore anglers, who prefer to fish alone in rivers where are not crowded with other anglers. That's the reason I would like it too. I like the idea. However it would reduce the number of anglers because I think most people look at fishing with the thought of cost and benefit. If cost exceeds benefit, then they probably won't do it. Benefit is usually measured by number of fish you catch, which not all of us think that way of course. Often I put it in perspective, asking some of my friends why people play golf if they are just giving money away to hit some balls. If people are willing to do that, why not spending money for fishing without expecting to make a profit out of it by bringing lots of fish home. Anyway, I am off the track. ;-) Anyway, I like it, and I think eventually it will come to that as fishing pressure continues to rise rapidly.
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Couple of points I would like to make here. First is that freshwater fishing in B.C. is one of the few ministries that is actually fully supported by the people who utilize the service. In terms of User pays it is self-supporting (or it could be) If 500,000 freshwater anglers pay $30 each for licenses thats 15 million dollars. Include tags, classified licenses and you have over 20 million dollars in licenses which is more than the ministries budget for administration of the freshwater fisheries. I wholeheartedly agree that improvements in licensing and education are needed. Our licensing system is archaic and burdensome. Our on-the- water behaviour is appalling and both of these can be addressed by the points Brett brings forth. Whats interesting Brett, is that I have brought forth the exact same points in the latest issue of BCFDF's newsletter. The second point I would like to make is that the BCFDF recognized the need for angler education years ago and implemented a program called "Pathways to Fishing" along with Berkely and FOC. For the past four years we have volunteered many days at tradeshows and exhibitions teaching kids (and their parents) the basics of angling in BC. Through a series of 10-12 different tables within the booth, we take the kids through gear types, angler ethics, fish identification, tying techniques, fish handling, and then a little casting practise. (As volunteers we DO take our lives in our hands at the casting tables :-) ) While all of this is a good introduction to angling, the idea of angler education needs to be expanded upon. I would suggest that if one wants to fish in rivers (the area of highest regulation, and multiple jurisdiction) that a 'moving water' course (similar to a CORE course) and licensing system would be appropriate.
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With today's technology, I fully agree with the fishing 'swipe-card' licensing. We need to make life a little easier for our officers and it would weed-out the criminal losers and the ignorant fools. It might allow for better control of the Scale Bar, by limiting the annual catch quotas for all species, thus removing the people retaining day after day. Good ideas.
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| Monday,
November 19, - 11:25 pm <16620&page=8/2150">
I think using a swipe card as licence is a great idea. Unfortunately, the fact is that if the DFO cant even spend a few officers to monitor the crowded spots, they will not spend the $$ for this idea. If it was up to me, I will just decrease the daily limit for salmon to one fish. This should weed out all the meatfisherman out there. Monitoring this would be easy as well, as soon as you boink your fish you have to stop fishing, like steelheading. Fishing should be enjoyed for the pleasure of catching fish and not just for the meat. Do we really have to kill 4 cohos a day? This should decrease the congestion in the river as most yoyos are meatfisherman.
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Lui, Its not up to FOC (DFO) to invest in the new licensing system. Its a provincial matter. The only input FOC has in this field is salmon tags. and jurisdiction over salmon when in fresh water.
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Although some rivers can easily sustain a 4 Coho per day catch, I agree that reducing it to 2 and forcing the fishermen to quit fishing afterwards is the key to reduced pressure and congestion. I still believe the best choice, if it was achievable, would be the 'card' with a hole punch section to record all catches of salmon limited to a per year catch. Buying a hole punch is cheap. Add the regulation to quit fishing after retention and you have a winner.
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O.K. Steve, but the problem is that many of these redneck fishermen who we have problems with on the river(s) would opt not to punch their card for every fish they catch. Right now we have to record specific catches on our license, but I know many people who conveniently neglect to do this. Self-policing is not the answer as shown by the issues on the Fraser this year. I like the test idea discussed above, but Rod has a good point: it will deter youngsters and parents from fishing.
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Hey Guys, As a father I have one thing that I would not want to stop, and thats kids fishing.They are our future, but they need to be taught right from wrong if we are going to sustain or increase the most valuable resource we so much cherish.We don't want anyone to stop fishing for that matter, but to just learn the proper rules and regulations that anglers need to know. This is such a precious sport, close to many of our hearts, and we should be looking out for it.A few people shouldn't be ruining it for all of us.Again, the only way to get people to change is to make a point,whether they learn the correct way or be fined.It sounds brutal, but we need change if we are going to have fishing for future generations.Do you want your kids and grand kids to have the option whether to fish or not? Brett Pott
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I don't think the test details are a huge detail, but if implemented it'd probably be some kind of idea where anyone getting their fishing for the first time would have to take it. Ie, kids when they turn 16 and any adults who have never fished before. Thing is, there are many people who take fishing up for the first time when their older. Now, they could take a course that would indefinitely leave an impression on them (it's easier to teach people who haven't developed their own set of ethics) or they could go out with the guy they work with who loves catching twice his limit etc., Lui the thing is that the government has already shown they won't pay for more officers. If there were a course the anglers taking the course and the person who teaches the course would be the ones involved. You can't make people at any fishin hole have ethics. Having officers breathing don't their necks won't teach them to release fish properly. It'll teach them they better go to a more secluded spot if they want to poach. You have to try to encourage fisherman to have ethics. Make an impression on them. Instead of telling people there "doing it wrong", try to suggest a better way of doing things. Don't tell, suggest! People will take it much more lightly.
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